A “Let them Work” demo took place on Saturday in Cardiff city centre, organised by STAR (Student Action for Refugees). This was part of a national day of action by STAR around the issue of the right to work for people seeking asylum, there was singing from the Red Choir and several speakers including the CEO of the Welsh Refugee Council Mike Lewis, Labour MP Julie Morgan, Liberal Democrat AM Jenny Randerson and Harris Nyatsanza from Oxfam. The campaign is also supported by Refugee Council, TUC and Brighter Futures.
No Borders South Wales activists were in attendance and we fully support the demonstration’s demand for the Right to Work. The way in which asylum seekers are forbiddento enter employment is abominable and indefensible, but we have our concerns about the way the campaign makes a distinction between ‘asylum seekers’ and other kinds of migrants. STAR state that:
The UK’s wider policy towards migrant workers is an entirely separate issue.
On the contrary, we see the treatment of refugees and other migrants as intimately interlinked and as being part of wider regime of labour and mobility control. We understand that this strategic demand could fundamentally change the living conditions of thousands of people seeking asylum, but arguments that explicitly separate migrants in this way also serves to bolster the governments division of people into manageable and controllable groups. Asking for more rights from the state is a limited strategy as immigration control cannot be ‘fair’ or ‘just’, new legislation will simply add to the multi-tiered system of control, coercion and exploitation. Similar points are raised in a new pamphlet on ‘amnesties’ (pdf) just published by No One Is Illegal.
We need to build campaigns for practical improvements in peoples lives whilst clearly rejecting divisions between ‘deserving’ and ‘undeserving’ migrants, as well as wider divisions between ‘citizens’ and ‘non-citizens’. It is only though fighting for ’freedom of movement and equality for all’ that the dignity for refugees that the STAR group are fighting for will truly be able to be realised.
31 comments
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March 4, 2009 at 12:57 am
angus mackay
Let them work? What work? Millions, yes millions, of our own people will probably be unemployed due to the worsening recession.
No one is illegal? Asylum seekers who have had their cases to remain in Britain legally listened to and a legal decision made that they have no legal right to remain in Britain but the failed asylum seekers refuse to leave are illlegal.
March 4, 2009 at 2:57 am
anarchol
Not doubt the recession is going to hit all of us hard, once again the greed of the rich will destroy the lives of ordinary people, though their wealth will insulate them from the hardships.
At times like this we must give our support to “our own people”. Our own people are working class people, wherever they happen to be born, the colour of their skin, the relgious traditions of their forebears and their immigration status do not matter. People born overseas are not the problem, the problem is
the rich who have enjoy the benefits of our hard work.
The way in which people can be fooled into blaming the victims is scary, it is the result of a situation where you are being lied to about asylum seekers.
March 4, 2009 at 3:31 pm
rob
Quite right,anarchol.
The financial crisis wasn’t caused by asylum seekers and it’s the banks that are receiving billions of pounds of taxpayers money to keep them afloat, not asylum seekers.
By the way what sort of reception did the demo get?
How was it publiscised?I’d have gone if I knew it was happenning.
March 5, 2009 at 1:43 am
angus mackay
I’ve had a look at the ‘‘being lied to about asylum seekers’’ leaflet. Here’s some of the lies about asylum seekers in the leaflet ….
From the leaflet:-
But they must be abusing the welfare system?
Hardly. Asylum seekers get just £37.77 a week – 30% below the poverty line. They are not allowed to claim other benefits.
The above is a lie
Asylum seekers receive weekly cash payments worth 70% of income Support for adults and 100% for children.
They also receive free furnished, repair free accommodation, free NHS treatment, free dentistry treatment, free spectacles, free education (nursery, school, college) free legal aid and translators and asylum seekers do not pay to light or heat the free homes they are in – the British taxpayer pays their heating and lighting bills whilst the indigenous have to choose, eat or heat.
From the leaflet:-
Are they pushing up Council Tax?
No. Services for asylum seekers are not paid for out of local taxes.
Yes, local council tax is not used to provide for asylum seekers. Where then does the money come from? Answer, the British taxpayers pay their income tax to ‘‘Westminster’’ who pass same onto city councils who use same for the upkeep of asylum seekers. ie, council tax finance and asylum seeker finance are met from the same financial pot – British taxpayers money.
And here’s another derisory piece from the absurd leaflet:-
Surely there’s not enough housing to go round?
If every asylum seeker left the country, there would still be a housing crisis.
Maybe there still would be a housing shortage but if every asylum seeker left the country it sure would free up thousands of more houses and places in our NHS and doctors’ surgeries and places in our schools and colleges.
March 5, 2009 at 8:11 am
rob
The usual racist mythology from the troll and sad because the poor sap believes it.
March 5, 2009 at 9:33 am
Dave
lol @ Angus.
Where do you get your info from?
Are you retarded?
You have no grasp about what the facts about asylum are, do you?
I’m sure you think we should keep Wales for the Welsh and deport all them parasitic foreigners huh? especially the Scottish… Perhaps it would be good if you educate yourself before you embarrass yourself even more..
March 5, 2009 at 9:55 am
angus mackay
rob resorted to insult:- ‘‘The usual racist mythology from the troll and sad because the poor sap believes it.’’
I was waiting for someone of your ilk to start posting. The fool who is unable to offer a counter-argument but merely resorts to the usual dead brain insults of ‘‘racist’’, ‘‘troll’’, ‘‘poor sap’’ et al.
Yes I believe ‘‘it’’, I know, I’ve checked out my posted facts from credible sources. rob, you choose any part of my posting and challenge it.
You are incapable of offering a credible response, hence, your class of defence, frequently expressed abusive language–the penultimate refuge of the empty-headed fool towards those who speak out against the massive asylum and immigration con.
March 5, 2009 at 10:09 am
Dave
Hey Angus, is this you? : http://www.theyworkforyou.com/msp/angus_mackay
You don’t “work for us” anymore though huh?
March 5, 2009 at 10:13 am
angus mackay
Dave, who is lol @ Angus.
Here’s where I get my information from …. House of Commons, London, SW1a 0AA / Glasgow Asylum Support Project / Freedom of Information Act 2002.
Another of rob’s ilk. You are another deluded asylum supporting fool, unable to offer a credible debate who resorts to insult …. and how sad to use the expression ‘‘retarded’’.
March 5, 2009 at 10:18 am
angus mackay
Dave, who asked:- Hey Angus, is this you? : http://www.theyworkforyou.com/msp/angus_mackay
You don’t “work for us” anymore though huh?
Nope. You got it wrong again. The MSP, Angus MacKay, is not me.
March 5, 2009 at 10:18 am
Dave
Angus, u r priceless.
Thanks for the postcode for the house of commons –
“ilk” – are you a bond villain?
March 5, 2009 at 12:18 pm
angus mackay
Dave posted his usual drivel …. Angus, u r priceless. Thanks for the postcode for the house of commons –
“ilk” – are you a bond villain? Nope, you got it wrong again, I’m a Scot, ilk means kind / type / class.
In passing, please refrain from using the word ‘‘retarded’’ outside of your own family or friends. It is extremely unlikely that those of special needs are reading this forum, but do bear in mind that the carers, relations and friends of special needs persons may well be viewing your comments. Your choice of rhetoric can be very hurtful and extremely offensive. Perhaps you would care to post an apology?
March 5, 2009 at 12:19 pm
Anonymous
Angus, you seem to be looking at the wrong enemy. If you believe that problems such as unemployment and higher council tax are related to asylum seekers you are misguided.
The global “credit crunch”, or depression, is a much higher factor in the rising unemployment, brought about by the capitalist economy. Asylum seekers are unable to work. If they do they have to do it illegally, hence the lower rates of pay. This benefits businesses as they can underpay workers, and the asylum seekers only seek to make money to afford to live. There again, the problem lies with businesses whose interest it is to keep asylum seekers unable to work legally, forcing them into underpaid jobs. I’m sure the asylum seekers themselves would prefer to be able to work for the minimum wage, on an equal footing with other workers.
As for migration itself, why do you think these people move? Why would it be a crime to escape war (which, incidentally, your source the house of commons brought about) and persecution? You seem to think that people, as of being born in a country where they fill face death and torture, through no fault of their own, do not deserve to be able to escape this.
March 5, 2009 at 12:22 pm
Anonymous
Angus-
“The above is a lie
Asylum seekers receive weekly cash payments worth 70% of income Support for adults ”
At the time of writing, 70% of income support was indeed £37.77 a week. So the fact is not a lie.
March 5, 2009 at 1:25 pm
welshboi
As someone who until recently worked with Asylum Seekers in Glasgow, where we have the highest proportional number of Asylum Seekers in the UK, I would like to first state that Mr Mackay’s opinion is thankfully in an extreme minority up here in the civilised north.
The people of Scotland are, in general, well educated about the problems that face people who flee terror and persecution and end up faced with the British asylum system. This is proven by the mass support for people who claim asylum, the large numbers of people who accept total strangers into their homes, who stood together with their asylum seeking neighbours to stop the fascistic terror of home office dawn raids, who donate clothes and money to help their fellow humans.
Mr Mackay you are an embarrassment to Scotland and thankfully your ignorance is not widespread.
You would expect them to pay for these things on £37 a week? How? Well maybe we should let them work, after all they have committed no crime aside from to flee terror and persecution. Every Asylum Seeker I have ever met has wanted to work. They are embarrassed to have to live on handouts as I’m sure many of us would be.
Most Asylum Seekers do not even want to be in this country. they would rather be at home with their friends and families. No doubt Mr Mackay will dispute this. I would ask him however how many asylum seeking people has he met? I would wager very few to none. I on the other hand have met hundreds upon hundreds, not a one of whom would not return home in a heartbeat were they not facing death, torture or worse at home.
There is no housing shortage. Vast numbers of perfectly good homes lay empty all over this fair island of ours. Left to rot by property speculators and landlords.
The NHS would collapse were it not for economic migrants, you wish to destroy the NHS Mr Mackay? I can assure you this is what would happen should we close our borders.
Mr Mackay. The asylum seeking community in this country is tiny and uses very few of the resources that our affluent society has to offer.
There is an even smaller minority however that siphon off vast amounts of our wealth and resources for their own parasitical gain. This minority Mr Mackay is the ruling class.
These people make up less than one percent of the population yet our entire society is structured to facilitate their ease of life and lazy work shy existence. If we were to rid ourselves of this tiny fraction of the population we could increase the standard of living for the entire country and have some to spare.
It is in their direction your ire should be directed Mr Mackay, not towards some of the most vulnerable members of our society.
I would suggest that Mr Mackay actually makes some effort to actually meet these people he treats with such scorn and takes some time to educate himself about the structure of British society and economy.
Keep up the good work No Borders peeps.
March 5, 2009 at 9:13 pm
angus mackay
‘‘Angus, you seem to be looking at the wrong enemy. If you believe that problems such as unemployment and higher council tax are related to asylum seekers you are misguided.’’
There are many reasons for the present recession which is bringing about unemployment and deprivation. If you feel that the ‘‘capitalist economy’’ is to blame then we must find an answer to change that within our society. What we most certainly do not want or need is the added burden of hundreds of thousands of asylum seekers siphoning out of our economy.
I am well aware of the not allowed to work and when asylum seekers come to Britain they know of the not allowed to work rule or if they didn‘t know then they are very quickly informed that they are not allowed to take up employment. If these people really want to work then they can go to another country (their first safe country for instance) and work. They choose to sit on their backsides for years and not work whilst living off our benefit system. Also, why would any responsible employer employ a person whose background cannot be checked out – most of these asylum seekers arrive without any passports or documents as to who they are. Work? Haven’t you heard? Britain is in a recession. The indigenous are looking for work.
And for those who do take jobs on the side, ‘‘they have to do it illegally’’ – they are benedfit cheats and liars. How many of them have undeclared savings – money made from the sale of their belongings prior to leaving for Britain? Why should asylum seekes be allowed to work ‘‘on an equal footing with other workers’’? There is a legal tried and tested system for those who wish to come to Britain and work and it is certainly not through claiming asylum.
‘‘As for migration itself, why do you think these people move?’’
Why do they move all the way to Britain? – To carry on risking your life to get to Britain after having reached a safe country negates any asylum claim. It proves that the over-riding aim is not safety, since that has already been achieved, but to get to this country. Therefore all those who have done this should be deported without appeal as bogus claims.” It’s theft by deception.
March 5, 2009 at 9:22 pm
angus mackay
welshboi, responds with the usual personal insults in an attempt to add credence to his comment. And uses the old, tired, played-out derisory infantile reference to ‘‘smaller minority however that siphon off vast amounts of our wealth and resources for their own parasitical gain’’ / ‘‘ruling class’’ / ‘‘entire society is structured to facilitate their ease of life and lazy work shy existence.’’ / ‘‘rid ourselves of this tiny fraction of the population’’. And his reference to ‘‘some of the most vulnerable members of our society’’ – asylum seekers? – welshboi, asylum seekers are not part of our society. And you’ve worked with asylum seekers. Are you one of the directors of an asylum /immigration ‘‘charity’’? Earning a big salary and expense account, with perks and a nice big pension all out of the taxpayers’ wage packets or are you one of the poor wee deluded minions used by the directors to entertain the asylum seekers?
‘‘Those who stood together with their asylum seeking neighbours to stop the fascistic terror of home office dawn raids’’
These sad cowardly little fools are criminals – they should have been arrested. The right of protest is a fundamental liberty in a free society, however when that protest becomes harassment and intimidation or the deliberate hindrance of officers carrying out the decisions of the court, then that is wrong and in this instance, criminal. ‘‘dawn raids’’ – there is no such happening – the correct term is collection for rightful and legal deportation.
Yes, Glasgow has the highest proportional number of Asylum Seekers in the UK. Glasgow is the only constituency out of 32 in Scotland to do a financial deal (British taxpayers’ money) with the Home Office to bring asylum seekers to this city. If asylum seekers are a benefit, why have none of the other 31 constituencies made a deal with the Home Office to bring asylum seekers to their areas? Because the rest of Scotland has witnessed and realised that asylum seekers are a crippling and potentially explosive burden.
Asylum seekers who come to Glasgow do not choose to come to Glasgow. They are sent here under the National Dispersal Scheme via the Home Office deal. It is estimated that two-thirds of all asylum seekers who are granted the right to stay in Scotland, leave for England. Problem is, once they leave, another asylum seeking family is moved into the vacant accommodation Sorry England, but Glasgow is now the back door and a revolving door for asylum seekers wishing to gain entry to England.
Asylum seekers do not receive only £37 a week. I expect those who support asylum seekers to state openly the benefits which asylum seekers are getting, not deliberately cover said benefits in an attempt to con the British taxpayer. How much is free heating and lighting worth per year.
If the asylum seekers ‘‘would rather be at home with their family and friends’’, why don’t they move to their nearest safe area within their own country or their nearest safe country where they can be close to their own people.? Why put thousands of miles between themselves and their own?
There is no housing shortage?
There is a vast shortage of habitable housing in Glasgow. At the time of the asylum seekers being brought to Glasgow there were reports of ‘seven thousand Glasgow pre-war homes, inhabited by Glaswegians, which are unsanitary and riddled with damp and rot.’ There were also reports of thousands of homeless people in Glasgow. There is a vast housing problem in Glasgow and these houses should have been made available to our own people – not doled out as free furnished accommodation to thousands of dispersed wandering nomad asylum seekers.
‘‘The NHS would collapse were it not for economic migrants, you wish to destroy the NHS Mr Mackay? I can assure you this is what would happen should we close our borders.’’
The NHS is in a deplorable state. Patients are dying from diseases contracted in hospitals. Remove the ‘‘economic migrants’’, pay our own doctors and nurses a decent wage and bring the NHS back to the wonderful institution it once was.
Finally, ‘‘welshboi’’. Do not lecture me or anyone else about the Scots. They are my people. You do not know the Scots …. and the Scots would not wish to know you.
March 5, 2009 at 10:18 pm
Anonymous
Angus- a simple humanitarian question:
what gives you the right to work and others not? By chance you were born here, I am 100% certain your outlook would be different had you been born in a nation that the UK invaded, bombing your village. Our country has started these wars which create the majority of migration (incidentally, the number one country of migration acceptance is Pakistan, which IS the first safe country) and our (and the USA’s) global cultural expansion means that western cultures are familiar.
“Why should asylum seekers be allowed to work ‘‘on an equal footing with other workers’’? ”
Why not? They are humans, just like you. They should have the right to work.
“why would any responsible employer employ a person whose background cannot be checked out”
A simple answer here- capitalism. Cheapest labour = largest profits.
“They choose to sit on their backsides for years and not work whilst living off our benefit system. ”
No, the are not legally allowed to work. They do not wish to put their application for asylum in danger, seeing as they are in one of the most precarious positions in our society.
“If you feel that the ‘‘capitalist economy’’ is to blame then we must find an answer to change that within our society. ”
Capitalism is not an isolated national issue. The western capitalist system is now global, to see the economy as isolated for nations is flawed, and that workers should see past borders to work to create a better society.
To think that you deserve better rights than other people based on the location of birth, when the conditions in their country that they seek to leave are in a major part created by western capitalism and expansionist wars is selfish and extremely arrogant.
March 6, 2009 at 9:48 am
angus mackay
Reply to a ‘‘simple humanitarian question’’ ….
I do not have the right to work, even in my own country. I must live by and meet certain rules and conditions and earn my right to work. I also must find a situation or person who will provide me with employment. If I choose to become self-employed, I must also accept these rules and conditions to enter into business.
Asylum seekers do not meet the rules and conditions. For those outside of Britain who wish to seek employment here, there is a procedure which they can use. Jumping the employment queues by claiming asylum is not part of that procedure (rules and conditions).
You offer ‘‘capitalism. Cheapest labour = largest profits’’ as an answer as to why any responsible employer would employ a person whose background cannot be checked out. Those who employ under those conditions are not responsible employers, hence the use of illegals.
Asylum seekers know they are not allowed to work. If they want to work, they can ‘‘get on their bikes’’ (remember that saying) and go elswhere. Not them.
YOU introduced the ‘‘capitalist economy’’ to the debate. Situations may be global but we can best bring about change working primarily within (and outside) our own society.
Big mistake on your part – never tell another person what he / she thinks. I do not believe I deserve or receive better rights than other people because I was born in Glasgow, Scotland. It is YOU who comes over as ‘‘selfish and extremely arrogant’’. You are advocating that the finance from the wage packets of the people of this country be distributed among foreigners whilst many of our (yours?) own people are living in deprivation. You want the indigenous to compete in their own country with asylum seekers and illegals for employment.
For each person from another country that benefits from this criminal theft of public money or other resources, someone in this country is deprived.
March 6, 2009 at 12:09 pm
rob
Christ,you’ve got a right one here.
What does indigenous mean, “white”?
I’m a Scottish immigrant in Wales,maybe I should just piss off back to Scotland instead of sponging off the “indigenous” Welsh people.
Maybe you should shove off back into your BNP supporting , Daily Mail reading hole.
March 6, 2009 at 12:24 pm
rob
Oh, and Mackay, if you had an accident or serious illness , would you insist on an “indigenous” doctor rather than a foreign doctor?Good luck on finding one. The health service would collapse without migrant workers.
March 6, 2009 at 1:26 pm
anonymous
Angus – “The NHS is in a deplorable state. Patients are dying from diseases contracted in hospitals. Remove the ‘‘economic migrants’’, pay our own doctors and nurses a decent wage and bring the NHS back to the wonderful institution it once was.”
You really do believe all the crap you read in the tabloids…
Hospital acquired infections are primarily caused by the overuse of antibiotics; these bugs genetically mutate and become resistant to more and more antibiotics which has happened over many years. People die from these infections because we can’t kill the bugs effectively anymore. Nature can be scarily adaptable. These bugs are not only found in hospitals they are also carried, quite possibly by your good self, up noses, under armpits and in the groin, many people come into hospital as a patient unknowingly carrying MRSA in one or all of these places on their body and through poor hygiene standards also help others to become carriers of this bug as well. If one these people they come into contact with happen to be immuno-compromised in anyway, such as after surgery, they may then become infected with this bug rather than become a carrier.
It’s a tricky situation, but i can assure you this issue is in no way related to migrant health workers!!!!! It is absolutely true what everyone else has tried to get across to you. Without the expertise and sheer number of migrant healthcare workers, including doctors and nurses, the NHS would absolutely collapse, no question. You should ask non-migrants who work in the NHS whether they would want to remove all of their colleagues who happen to be migrants…..I think you can guess what the answer would be, so please stop talking about things you know nothing about.
March 6, 2009 at 1:56 pm
welshboi
I thought I was extremely polite given the overall offensiveness of your tone and demeanor.
Um, that’s the way society works. There is a tiny ruling class, less than 1%, that lives off, extracts value from, the labour of the vast majority.
Many of my neighbours are asylum seekers, their children are in the same schools as my other neighbours kids, we shop in the same places. We chat at the bus stop. We lend each other bits and bobs when we haven’t got time to pop down the shops. They’re certainly a part of my society and that of many working class Glaswegians.
No, I gave up my days off work in order to help parts of my community who are being treated deplorably by the home office, by their landlord and by the UK government. Same as many working Glaswegians.
You sir have a very strange definition of the word cowardice if you think that working people and pensioners getting out of their beds whilst it is still dark in order to protect their neighbours from armed men is cowardice.
So you are saying that there is no such thing as dawn raids? I afraid you really are living in cloud cuckoo land here Mr Mackay. Both the UK and Scottish governments have acknowledged the policy of dawn raids and they have been extensively documented in the press.
Everyone here has been perfectly honest. No one has denied that many asylum seekers get electricity token from their housing providers. I have known many people however go without electricity for days on end as the landlord has not provided these. I have seen heavily pregnant women forced to live in mould infested slums that are not fit for habitation.
a) The UK has a misleading reputation in many countries of being a welcoming world power who seek to protect the world. this is the impression that is put forward abroad. Many believe it and so flee here.
The UK takes less asylum seekers than anywhere else in, pre-expansion, Europe.
Go and check some figures that don’t come from the Daily Mail or the ‘Voice of Freedom’
No, no there isn’t. At the present moment there are hundreds upon hundreds of empty houses in the next scheme along from me that are being left to rot by the Glasgow housing Association who hope to be able to sell the land to developers.
Which begs the question of why did the council rid itself of all its social housing stock. The council are to blame for any, manufactured, crisis with regards housing in the city. there are plenty of homes to go around.
Don’t you just think that they are just workshy though Mr Mackay? I mean that would fit with the rest of your opinions.
No. The main housing provider in Glasgow is Angel housing. A notorious slum landlord corporation which came to Glasgow five(?) years ago and bought up hundreds of uninhabitable properties in order to house asylum seekers. People do not claim asylum in the UK for a house in Red Road, Sighthill, Maryhill or Govan you buffoon! FFS!
You are an embarrassment. I have shown your drivel to many of my workmates and neighbours who are appalled by your wilful ignorance.
March 7, 2009 at 10:18 pm
angus mackay
welshboi …..
I’ll spare you a few final minutes and deal with your sanctimonious garbage.
‘‘Um, that’s the way society works. There is a tiny ruling class, less than 1%, that lives off, extracts value from, the labour of the vast majority’’ ….
Um, that’s the way asylum works. There is a scrounging asylum class, more than 1%, that lives off, extracts value from, the wage packets of the vast majority.
‘‘Many of my neighbours are asylum seekers, their children are in the same schools as my other neighbours kids, we shop in the same places. We chat at the bus stop. We lend each other bits and bobs when we haven’t got time to pop down the shops. They’re certainly a part of my society and that of many working class Glaswegians’’ ….
You’re in that situation because you are a failure, an inadequate and a non-achiever. Those such as yourself who can’t make it in their own communities and countries are prone to blaming their failure on others. Hence your finger-pointing at the ‘‘ruling class’’? Asylum seekers are not part of Scottish society and you know absolutely zero about Glaswegians.
‘‘No, I gave up my days off work in order to help parts of my community who are being treated deplorably by the home office, by their landlord and by the UK government. Same as many working Glaswegians’’ ….
Being treated deplorably by the UK government? The same government that gives asylum seekers FREE furnished, repair FREE accommodation, FREE medical treatment, FREE dentistry, FREE spectacles, FREE school or college education, FREE money, FREE gas and electricity, FREE legal aid to keep them here when their cases come up again and again for review and the FREE use of translators to make sure they get it all. And on application, our fine, caring Home Office will return your asylum seekers to their own country – and it’s FREE, FREE, FREE. – but the asylum scroungers will not leave us.
Deplorably treated by their landlord? What’s their problem? The asylum seekers were supposed to be fleeing from murder, torture, rape, victimisation etc.,etc., etc. They’ve got their place of safety. Maybe(lol) they weren’t fleeing from anything, maybe(lol) they were fleeing towards ALL FREE.
‘‘You sir have a very strange definition of the word cowardice if you think that working people and pensioners getting out of their beds whilst it is still dark in order to protect their neighbours from armed men is cowardice’’ ….
They are cowards, foul-mouthed cowards – they knew no action would be taken against them so they formed a cowardly little mob to scream abuse and harass our immigration officers. These conned, used fools haven’t even sussed out that whilst they are struggling to pay council tax and rent and heating, the failed asylum seekers they were illegally helping to illegally abscond have been sitting in our rent free, council tax free, heating free houses for years.
You have chosen to ignore my reference to the law, here it is again, now pay attention …. The right of protest is a fundamental liberty in a free society, however when that protest becomes harassment and intimidation or the deliberate hindrance of officers carrying out the decisions of the court, then that is wrong and in this instance, criminal.
‘‘So you are saying that there is no such thing as dawn raids? I afraid you really are living in cloud cuckoo land here Mr Mackay’’ ….
There is no such happening as a ‘‘dawn raid’’ – the correct term is “collection for rightful and legal deportation.”
Quote from a communication from the then Immigration Department:- ‘in a recent experiment approximately 40 families we invited to present themselves for deportation but of these, approximately 39 then disappeared and have not been seen since.’
How else do you expect our immigration officials to collect failed asylum seekers? If the failed asylum seekers would turn up for rightful legal deportation, there would be no requirement to collect them. Nor would our appointed immigration officers be subjected to the foul-mouthed rantings from riff-raff asylum supporters.
‘‘Everyone here has been perfectly honest. No one has denied that many asylum seekers get electricity token from their housing providers. I have known many people however go without electricity for days on end as the landlord has not provided these. I have seen heavily pregnant women forced to live in mould infested slums that are not fit for habitation’’ ….
There are 300 patients with advanced kidney cancer in Scotland who are being denied a drug, due to lack of finance, which could prolong their lives.
Also, if your ‘‘heavily pregnant women forced to live in mould infested slums that are not fit for habitation’’ are asylum seekers, they are not forced to live in the UK – they have the choice to leave. The indigenous cannot leave, they must stay.
‘‘a) The UK has a misleading reputation in many countries of being a welcoming world power who seek to protect the world. this is the impression that is put forward abroad. Many believe it and so flee here.
The UK takes less asylum seekers than anywhere else in, pre-expansion, Europe.
Go and check some figures that don’t come from the Daily Mail or the ‘Voice of Freedom’’’ ….
a) So why don’t they flee somewhere else when they find out that the UK is not a ‘‘welcoming world power who seek to protect the world’’. Our Home Office will gladly give them every assistance to leave. Even when the failed asylum seekers are told they have no right to be in the UK, they try every underhanded tactic to stay in the UK.
b)You cannot possibly put that forward as fact – the number of asylum seekers in the UK isn’t known. ‘‘Daily Mail’’ / ‘Voice of Freedom’ …. I never read these titles, you obviously do, would you recommend them?
‘‘No, no there isn’t. At the present moment there are hundreds upon hundreds of empty houses in the next scheme along from me that are being left to rot by the Glasgow housing Association who hope to be able to sell the land to developers’’ ….
Empty houses – houses that are not fit to be lived in. At the present moment Glasgow Council is demolishing thousands of flats in the high rise blocks. There is a vast shortage of habitable housing in Glasgow. I know, I have lived all my life in Glasgow, I see the poverty and deprivation. Thousands of Glaswegians are living in housing squalor.
‘‘Which begs the question of why did the council rid itself of all its social housing stock. The council are to blame for any, manufactured, crisis with regards housing in the city. there are plenty of homes to go around’’ ….
It doesn’t beg any question from you or answer to you. The homeless, the shortage of housing, the unsanitary houses, have been a part of Glasgow for years. Out with the asylum seekers and illegals and use British taxpayers’ money on our own people. Oh, and cease funding the asylum seekers’ money-guzzling ‘‘charities’’.
“There were also reports of thousands of homeless people in Glasgow.”
Don’t you just think that they are just workshy though Mr Mackay? I mean that would fit with the rest of your opinions’’ ….
I have never thought of my homeless people as being ‘‘workshy’’. You introduced ‘‘workshy’’ – it’s obviously in your thoughts – means that would fit with the rest of your opinions.
‘‘No. The main housing provider in Glasgow is Angel housing. A notorious slum landlord corporation which came to Glasgow five(?) years ago and bought up hundreds of uninhabitable properties in order to house asylum seekers. People do not claim asylum in the UK for a house in Red Road, Sighthill, Maryhill or Govan you buffoon! FFS!’’ ….
No. The main housing provider in Glasgow is Glasgow Housing Association. People do not claim asylum in the UK for a house in Red Road, Sighthill, Maryhill or Govan you buffoon! FFS! …. People claim asylum in the UK because they are supposedly fleeing torture, rape, murder, discrimination etc – didn’t you know that? They are supposed to be claiming sanctuary, refuge, a place safety. So what did they really come for – a nice wee free bungalow with a back and front garden, with free central heating, luxurious fitted all mod cons kitchen, an up-to-date bathroom, adjoining garage with a free car inside in an upmarket desirable area? And what did our big bad nasty government give them, a house in Red Road, Sighthill, Maryhill or Govan. How sad, now they will just have to live alongside Glaswegians who have been housed in Red Road, Sighthill, Maryhill and Govan. YOU MORON! FFS!
‘‘You are an embarrassment. I have shown your drivel to many of my workmates and neighbours who are appalled by your wilful ignorance’’ ….
Mission acclompished. I have found a use for you, another buffoon. Thanks for showing my comments to many of your workmates and neighbours. I’m sure I will have enlightened some of them as to how asylum seekers are siphoning cash out of their wage packets. I wouldn’t waste my time showing your garbage to anyone.
welshboi …..
So what’s your next level of attack? Are you about to start screaming RACIST! RACIST! RACIST ! About to pull out your wee deck of cards and play your racist card, the derisory joker racist card used against anyone, MP, MSP, councillor or anyone to stop us from exposing the massive, money-guzzling obscene asylum and immigration con.
March 7, 2009 at 10:20 pm
angus mackay
rob ….
‘‘Christ,you’ve got a right one here.
What does indigenous mean, “white”?
I’m a Scottish immigrant in Wales,maybe I should just piss off back to Scotland instead of sponging off the “indigenous” Welsh people.
Maybe you should shove off back into your BNP supporting , Daily Mail reading hole.
Oh, and Mackay, if you had an accident or serious illness , would you insist on an “indigenous” doctor rather than a foreign doctor?Good luck on finding one. The health service would collapse without migrant workers.’’
Thank you rob. Glad you think I’m right. I just knew I could influence your racist filled little mind. You ask the meaning of indigenous …. no it doesn‘t mean white …. it means native to an area / belonging naturally to a place. Trust this helps with your enquiry.
BNP supporting? Daily Mail reading hole? How sad, the usual racial typical asylum support rhetoric.
Oh, and rob, yes, I would insist on an “indigenous” (native to an area / belonging naturally to a place) doctor rather than a foreign doctor. There are no shortage of highly skilled ‘‘indigenous’’ doctors in Britain and there could be many more if only our money could be invested in keeping and bringing our ‘‘indigenous’’ into the NHS. The NHS would flourish without asylum seekers asylum, failed asylum seekers, illegals, health migrants and other wandering foreign nomads.
Please don’t ‘‘piss off back to Scotland’’.
March 7, 2009 at 10:23 pm
angus mackay
anonymous ….
‘‘You really do believe all the crap you read in the tabloids…
Hospital acquired infections are primarily caused by the overuse of antibiotics; these bugs genetically mutate and become resistant to more and more antibiotics which has happened over many years. People die from these infections because we can’t kill the bugs effectively anymore. Nature can be scarily adaptable. These bugs are not only found in hospitals they are also carried, quite possibly by your good self, up noses, under armpits and in the groin, many people come into hospital as a patient unknowingly carrying MRSA in one or all of these places on their body and through poor hygiene standards also help others to become carriers of this bug as well. If one these people they come into contact with happen to be immuno-compromised in anyway, such as after surgery, they may then become infected with this bug rather than become a carrier.
It’s a tricky situation, but i can assure you this issue is in no way related to migrant health workers!!!!! It is absolutely true what everyone else has tried to get across to you. Without the expertise and sheer number of migrant healthcare workers, including doctors and nurses, the NHS would absolutely collapse, no question. You should ask non-migrants who work in the NHS whether they would want to remove all of their colleagues who happen to be migrants…..I think you can guess what the answer would be, so please stop talking about things you know nothing about.’’
You’ve posted a pointless comment. I wasn’t accusing ‘‘economic migrants’’ of being responsible for the diseases contracted in hospitals. Remove the ‘‘economic migrants’’ was a reference to saving finance,
If you would take your time in reading and make an attempt to understand comments you might not come over as talking about things you know nothing about.
Whilst we are on ‘‘health matters’’, I’ll leave you with this ….
When cancer invades a body, it lives off the body’s ‘‘resources’’. The host body cannot sustain itself and when the host body dries up and dies, the cancer dies. The cancer has committed suicide. Do you understand?
March 7, 2009 at 10:25 pm
angus mackay
I’ll leave all you lefty liberal, bleeding heart, do gooding political correct saddos to your website (probably funded by our kind, over generous government). I’ve had a wee bit fun.
We’ve important work to do in Glasgow. Britain is heading downward to a situation most of us will never have experienced before. It’s important Glaswegians are made aware of the absolute obscenity whereby freeloading asylum seekers can sit on their backsides for years for free whilst we have to pick their bills. Free heating for asylum seekers whilst our senior citizens, and others, have to choose – EAT OR HEAT. It’s an obscenity.
To the ‘‘moderators’’ of this website ….
My apologies for the substandard rhetoric used. It is/ was never my intention to enter into this low level debate but as usual I am treated to insults (extremely mild in this instance) from the class of person who supports the asylum seeker and who is unable to post a credible defence of the massive asylum and immigration con.
March 28, 2009 at 10:30 pm
R. A.
I really appreciate what you guys doing here.
Its a high language level to me, in spit of the difficulty that I face I will participate in this debate. I wish I’ll reach the high understanding and clarity for you as its not natural for me like you.
I came to an internet cafe in the town after getting a leaflet from some protesters in front of the Homeoffice border agency building of Cardiff, that made me interested to access online and find out what’s going on for us.
let me first introduce my self, I am Ram, an Iraqi origin, came from Baghdad, and due to circumstances I couldnt go back home, claiming the asylum here. I have been in Wales/Cardiff for almost 2 years now have nothing to do but waiting for the decision of my asylum application. You can image all the wasted time from life!. Me and some people that I know like me have nobody to support as or to complain about our suffer. Voiceless! we need our voice to reach…. It really gives great feeling when knowing some people patronize us. We are not getting the welcome face wherever we go or apply. While I have the full qualification and used to have the good life standard back home but the problem is with NO security. Its driving us really crazy with all this period of waiting for unknown decision, and its continuing unfortunately. IT’S LIKE WE ARE PAING OUR LIFE TIME AS A PENELTY FOR THE “GOOG SEUIRITY”.
What made me quickly want to leave a comment here after reading some of them above, is there are some people here have a very wrong view about us. Specially angus mackay. Listen Mr.Mackay, if you just image for a while puting your self in my situation, born and lived in a country that the US & UK invaded, bombing your town, you walk in the street and a bomb happened about 200m away from you, walk in the street scared, looking right, left and behind afraid of someone carying a gun or a military group pass beside you and accept a shooting or bombing anytime anywhere. YOUR country has started these wars Mr.Mackay, as someone said it here before, which create the majority of migration . . .
Look, I SWEAR with my mother life which I havent seen here for ages, that if my home town is safe I wouldnt come and stay waste time from life for nothing, and let some guy like you think and talk rubish about us I wouldnt leave my family, fiends, love, our food. . . we are not in love with your country. . man. . . remember . . put it always in your mind. . its the conditions.
Me as I am Iraqi, I am proud to remind you that we are the oldest civilization on the earth, we tout the human been on earth to write, we are the first people on this earth who created the legislations and laws. No body doubt that. Before any people found in any other part of the world like Europe or US. But unfortunately, wars after wars made us run behind. . . its the badluck which drove us to this situation.
I left Iraq, Baghdad for threat and bad security, Not because of hunger or anything else. So I am expecting continuing my life here normally at least the standard one but the difference is without any threat.
I used to study for my higher education “M.Sc.” and for publications, I used to work, used to have my own business, I used to have my own Art Gallery. I never used to live like this and wasting years from life doing nothing, just a penalty for the “good” security ?? !!
I am only an example, talking on behalf of many people like me who have no chance to know about you and to talk.
We need a solution; there must be a solution ladies and gentlemen. I want to tell the HomeOffice that, . . . . We don’t want the benefits, we don’t want to set, eat and sleep only just like animal life. Answer us, Yes to live like other Hume been and work, or NO and at least send us to another safer place to live in a country who welcome us as refugee and continue our lives normally till the security back in our hometown.
Again If I am sure its safe back home i wouldn’t waste a single minute from my life here.
April 1, 2009 at 11:45 pm
Mali and Amy
Hi
I’d just like to say well done to no borders south Wales and I’d like to join in any protests I can. I live in Splott so could easily join the ones on Newport Rd. Should I just turn up with a poster when I see the next date?!
It’s so good to have all the facts here to back up my arguments and hopefully I’ll be able to bring some people I know out of their smallminds!
As for Angus Mackay, he’s quite an upsetting man isn’t he?
I think he’s a person that won’t listen to what ever reasoning you try and I’ll bet, not a very happy man.
I wonder, if faced with a little girl and her mum and he had the power to send them back to a war torn country where they could be raped and killed he would choose to keep them in this country or not.
I wonder if someone was dying of thirst on his doorstep he’d spare them a glass of water.
I hope he gets deported to mars
lots of love
Mali and Amy x
April 6, 2009 at 12:03 pm
anonymous
Dear R.A.,
thanks so much for your comment, it must be quite shocking to read comments from those like angus mckay who have been completely taken in by british tabloids that they cant even begin to imagine what it must be like to escape a situation like you did in Iraq, and the life that you were forced to leave behind. It is great to hear that our pickets are worthwhile and that it brings hope to people through solidarity and support. You are very welcome to come to our meetings every thursday at 7pm at The Wyndham Street Centre, 3-5 Wyndham Street, Riverside. It would be great to work together to find other ways in which our group can support migrants in cardiff!
and Mali and Amy, it would be great to have more people at the pickets on newport road, weve got plenty of placards and leaflets, so bring whatever you like and see you at the next one, the date hasnt been decided yet, but will post it up on the blog when we have.
Cheers!
April 10, 2009 at 2:00 pm
R.A.
its in French but translated to english . . you can read while listening